Proposal to separate the Skeet and Trap State Carnival
(Excerpt from document)..
The purpose of this proposal is to separate the Skeet and Trap State Title Carnival.
Historically the “State Trap” competition of the current State Carnival format has
always been the dominant portion of the weekend, attracting the majority of the
shooters local and interstate, as well as the major share of sponsorship.
By separating the skeet from the current format we believe we will attract interstate
and international skeet shooters; it will also expose local entrants to an annual
higher standard of competition and provide our State Carnival greater credibility in
the National arena.
Western Australia (WA) is the only state in Australia that does not hold separate
state titles for each discipline. On a national level this puts WA at a disadvantage as
the current format attracts relatively high attendance numbers for the skeet on day 1,
as it is included in the carnival A/O high gun.
A false representation in the skeet discipline is presented as a large number of these
shooters would not be attending for the skeet alone.
This proposal is aimed to see the skeet discipline develop and grow in its own right.
The State Skeet carnival programme needs to be a serious stand alone event. As
the WACTA Executive is made of voluntary workers spread throughout WA, it is
proposed that the each individual club applying for the state title be responsible for
the running and organization of this event following the guide lines as advised by the
WACTA Committee.
The host clubs applying for this event would require a minimum of 3 Skeet Layouts.
The following proposal covers all aspects of the change including; dates, finances
and organisation.Read the complete proposal document.
(end of excerpt.)
Please submit your comments, and or contact your WACTA zone delegate or club committee about this proposal. As this is a major change and we want to hear all comments before the decision is made, not after when it is too late.
The purpose of this proposal is to separate the Skeet and Trap State Title Carnival.
Historically the “State Trap” competition of the current State Carnival format has
always been the dominant portion of the weekend, attracting the majority of the
shooters local and interstate, as well as the major share of sponsorship.
By separating the skeet from the current format we believe we will attract interstate
and international skeet shooters; it will also expose local entrants to an annual
higher standard of competition and provide our State Carnival greater credibility in
the National arena.
Western Australia (WA) is the only state in Australia that does not hold separate
state titles for each discipline. On a national level this puts WA at a disadvantage as
the current format attracts relatively high attendance numbers for the skeet on day 1,
as it is included in the carnival A/O high gun.
A false representation in the skeet discipline is presented as a large number of these
shooters would not be attending for the skeet alone.
This proposal is aimed to see the skeet discipline develop and grow in its own right.
The State Skeet carnival programme needs to be a serious stand alone event. As
the WACTA Executive is made of voluntary workers spread throughout WA, it is
proposed that the each individual club applying for the state title be responsible for
the running and organization of this event following the guide lines as advised by the
WACTA Committee.
The host clubs applying for this event would require a minimum of 3 Skeet Layouts.
The following proposal covers all aspects of the change including; dates, finances
and organisation.Read the complete proposal document.
(end of excerpt.)
Please submit your comments, and or contact your WACTA zone delegate or club committee about this proposal. As this is a major change and we want to hear all comments before the decision is made, not after when it is too late.
I agree
Separate skeet from trap and add double rise to the trap state carnival program this will be more appealing for those shooters who travel long distance to attend the carnival.
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this would be a monumental step in the right direction 5 proper state titles over one weekend and no mickey mouse events(ie wacta champ of champs)
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I support the separation of the skeet from the trap. 3 days of competition in each discipline would be fantastic, plus it would improve the strength of our traveling state teams. plus a 3 day state carnival would defiantly interest interstate shooters. Too many pluses to not support the proposal...
3 supporters of separation....there must be more..what ever your thoughts please leave a comment for or against the proposal.. it is your chance to let us know...
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I totally agree with all of the above.
Best thing that could happen for both disciplines of the sport.
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I agree in principle to the proposed changes as it would make the trap carnival a much stronger event. However I can not see how it would benefet the skeet.There are more trap shooters than skeet shooters so can we hold a state skeet carnival as a stand alone event with out dropping signifantly in numbers. Regards Normy
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I fully support the comments above therefore the proposed carnival separation.
Lets face the facts, trap is the most competitive and popular of all the clay disciplines. For too long WA has been out of step with the other states in regards to its state carnivals.
Their trap carnivals are major events and come second in size only to the DTL Nats (NSW and Vic in particular get 300+ entries). Our trap program should conform with other state programs which may then attract the serious interstate shooters which can only lift the standard in WA.
As for skeet, its popularity has been on the decline across Australia for sometime, sad but true. It is not a state but rather a national trend.
In my view ACTA, in consultation with the state bodies, should be developing strategies to address this situation. Its not rocket science: Why are numbers declining and what can be done to increase its popularity?
However, here in WA, Trap should not be held back from further expansion / development and used as an excuse to help "prop" up skeet. There are enough skeet shooters around to support a separate state carnival, the secret is to get them to participate at this level....similar to DTL shooters.
In conclusion, the proposal has my personal and full support; I hope the general consensus will be along the same lines. I don't believe their are any losers here; our overall clay shooting sport will be the winner!
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This proposal raises my ire for several reasons.
Firstly, it gives the trap people what they want; to forget about skeet. With skeet separated from the state carnival, they will no longer have to think about skeet, and they will happily ignore it and those who shoot it. This might not be the most diplomatic way to put it, but you know it is true.
Secondly, it seems that Geraldton will do very nicely out of this, while Albany will get shat on. It may be true that (as a trap carnival), the majority of shooters going to Albany on the January long weekend (not in fact, a long weekend anymore), are trap shooters, there are a few who shoot skeet, myself included. I would be very tempted to go to a skeet state title event instead of our January shoot, and who knows how many other would be? Given that for the recent shoots we have had only 50-60 shooters, the loss of any more could be problematic, from the point of shooters, and from the organisation/operations side, as many of our club members (who might want to shoot skeet) assist with the carnival without shooting.
If there were 100 or so shooters turning up to our shoot, I wouldn't be so concerned, but given the current level of support, I can't see a state title event, on the same weekend, as anything other than a major threat to the viability of the Albany January shoot and to a degree, of the Albany club itself. If Geraldton is so happy to propose this, especially as they would possibly benefit from their pre-states carnival, perhaps they should sacrifice one of their carnivals so that they can host the skeet states on some weekend other than the Albany January shoot. I'd like to see that.
Thirdly, while it might be lovely to produce a table stating how much an event costs and will make, the reality is not as rosy as made out. I would imagine that the costs and returns are going to be different for many clubs, but having only 60 shooters is not the most profitable situation. At Albany, we are in the situation where, were it not for sponsorship, we would barely make a profit, from 50-60 shooters. Perhaps other clubs will make better returns (probably through lower costs), but I would suggest that the carrot of thousands of dollars of profits that this proposal has dangled is optimistic or even non-existent.
Perhaps as a state title event it will pull in big sponsorship, but human nature being what it is, the temptation would surely be (for the sponsors) to go where the real crowds are; as in the state trap titles. To suggest that this state skeet event would be a great cash cow for that hosting club would seem to be a very fragile assertion.
Truly, I don't have anything against the idea of having separate carnivals for the skeet and trap disciplines. But at the moment, I can see 2 slight winners (Geraldton, the trap states), one with no obvious benefit (the skeet states), and one with likely downsides (Albany). All of which is not good enough from this current proposal.
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Please check out the WACTA minutes 10-01-09 item 11-10 as the clash with Albany's carnival or any clubs 2 day carnival won't happen.
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